Racers used to worry about the use of steel stators in a torque converter, specifically in turbo applications where issues would arise relating to the heat they generated during long spooling times. Hi, had a spare TCE laying around so put it into the Mrs TTG on the weekend for a bit of fun. Going a bit deeper, Caine explains when it’s best to do this, and what not to do when trying to find your stall speed range. “ The size of the converter you need, whether it’s an 8-, 9-, or 10-inch is determined by the load sensitivity of your engine. Many drivers simply don’t push their vehicles hard enough to heat the catalytic converter to its most-efficient temperature—between 800 °F (426 °C) and 1,832 °F (1,000 °C)—leading to premature failure. Changing the blade geometry of the stator and/or turbine will change the torque-stall characteristics, as well as the overall efficiency of the unit. Having a converter with the correct stall speed will make your car fun to drive at the track or on the street, and will give you those nice, consistent elapsed times on your ticket, pass after pass. Viele übersetzte Beispielsätze mit "converter stall" – Deutsch-Englisch Wörterbuch und Suchmaschine für Millionen von Deutsch-Übersetzungen. To an extent, the overall diameter and the internal construction of a converter can cause a substantial change in footbrake stall. What would be the best approach, a higher stall converter or a 4.11 or so rear end ratio? Hey I have 2000 Chevy Silverado lifted on 35s and I’m putting a 5.3ls in it with ls9 camshaft and all the goodies but I don’t know much about stall speed although this page did help a lot. Broader knows his stuff and can fix you up. 3. The car will seem very lazy when you launch, and your 60-foot times will be poor, causing your elapsed times to rise. The range listed will tell you what to expect from the converter. A 2,000- or 2,400-stall converter works well for cam durations under 248 degrees. You’ll often hear people talk about how loose or tight a converter is based on its stall speed, which is dictated by the angles of the blades on the torque converter’s pump. 3- Determine the type of transmission to be used. For more information about stall speeds and for more knowledge to get your gears reaving, stay tuned for our next installment! In order to check your torque converter, you might have to perform a stall-speed test. Most of what Ive read … I am thinking of doing this and was wondering if it will help the car at all. In general, the larger the converter, typically the tighter and more efficient it will be,” Caine says. In order to make any change… If your torque converter fails, the engine can stall out. Get proven performance and reliability from B&M, TCI, Turbo Action, Hughes Performance, ATI Performance Products, Performance Automatic, and other leading brands. The reality is that a torque converter has a range of speed that the stall can engage in, and that will change based on the previously mentioned factors. Spending his childhood at different race tracks around Ohio with his family’s 1967 Nova, Brian developed a true love for drag racing. The basic rule applies: you should get a torque converter built to your specific combination and intentions so the stall speed is correct. When your torque converter prevents the power transfer from your engine to your transmission, it increases the engine’s RPM stalls. I have also seen a post suggesting that I try a stall converter instead? Nelson Gill, President and CEO of ACC Performance, then demonstrated how variables in engine setup — things like cylinder heads and exhaust choice — can change your ideal stall speed in Part 2 of the series. Too much stall RPM will actually slow a car down by wasting part of the engine's useful power curve. If I do the gear change, it would be from the stock 2.87 to 3.55 gears. This will allow your … Overall, the switch to a torque converter that has a stall speed targeted towards our future upgrades on the Red Dragon is working out as planned. the more torque you feed a converter the higher it will stall. To learn more about RevMax Performance Torque Converters, please visit our online store. Do you think I must change the stall converter, or is that a suggestion. Chance adds some additional details on how the converter size interacts with the car. The key is not to have the torque converter flash its stall speed too far below that level or it won’t work properly, as it will bog and delay the acceleration of the car. The heavier a car is, the more load it will put on the torque converter when power is applied, causing it to flash at a higher speed. A stock torque converter in an AOD equipped Mustang will produce a stall speed of about 1800RPM, … 24-13-05 $1,320.00. High-stall ratio converters are usually relatively inefficient below the coupling speed, whereas low-stall ratio converters tend to provide less possible torque multiplication. Each part of the torque converter plays an important role in making sure the stall speed is correct. I'd like more snap off the line and for more rpm's before shifting. The advertised duration is 275/291 degrees while duration at .050-inch hangs on for 225/238 degrees. After doing some research, we found the ATI StreetMaster torque converter with a single disk lock-up, and it fit the bill perfectly, so we made the call to pick one up. If a 2700-3000 is selected, you should be able to footbrake stall the converter to about 2700 rpm depending on the vehicle’s setup. Here’s what’s important to remember about what chickens need: A way to roost at night. The biggest part of the torque converter that will change the stall speed is the stator. That converter mihgt stall at 2600rpm behind my NA 350, the same converter may stall 3300rpm behind a 454 and maybe 3900 rpm behind Steve's RJ502. If you’re planning on bringing a power-adder into the mix with your car, that will absolutely require a change in your torque converter’s stall speed. This converter was stock, it was 1200 RPM flash stall. For example, a motor that makes a lot of torque and makes it at a lower RPM needs a much larger diameter converter because it has a much faster rate of efficiency. The main factors that go into calculating the stall speed for any car include the weight of the car, the circumference of the rear tires, the gear ratio, and of course, the engine’s performance level. Sorry if this was a dumb question? 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Cars with an automatic will require a stall converter for good drivability. JEGS carries a complete line of torque converters for racing applications ready to ship to your door at everyday low prices. The stall speed is the level where the engine’s force can’t overcome the hydraulic pressure, and varies for a number of reasons. P I am considering changing the converter in my car. For example, when you press down on your gas pedal, the stall speed is the gap between where your vehicle ideals and begins to move. The hard parts of the torque converter that really affect the stall speed are the overall size of the converter, the pump blade angle, and the stator. Stall speed should be selected so that the torque converter will reach its stall speed just before the engine starts its power-band (when torque output begins increasing sharply). In testing, the Red Dragon ran a best of 10.94 at 123 mph with a 1.53 60-foot time. For example, drag racing automatic transmissions often use converters modified to produce high stall speeds to improve off-the-line torque, and to get into the power band of the engine more quickly. If anything, it's weaker. Save $10 off $299, $20 off $699, $30 off $899, $100 off $1,899 Orders - Promo Code: HIGHGEAR exclusions apply. It’s also possible to go too tight with a converter in your street/strip car, and that will cause its own set of issues. While it’s true that, many times, the root cause of a converter failure lies in the transmission, in this case, there is ample evidence that the opposite is true: an inherent torque converter problem might be the root cause of a lot of the transmission failures. Where that power comes in will drastically change what the converter does, so a nitrous converter won’t be effective in a boosted application. “For a race-only application, the basic rule is to get the converter to flash just above peak torque. When your torque converter prevents the power transfer from your engine to your transmission, it increases the engine’s RPM stalls. Stall speed is the speed at which the converter holds back or limits the engine speed if the transmission output is prohibited. The best 60 foot my car had before with a competitors converter was 1.84 but typically they were in the 1.90’s. © 2020 Power Automedia. Going to a reputable torque converter manufacturer like ATI with your vehicle’s information will allow them to build you a unit that will have a stall speed catered to your vehicle and its goals. Is there anything that needs to be done when changing the stall converter or is it just a matter of taking the old one off and bolting on a new one. Also curious about stall rpm and if there is any tuning required. Are there places you can send your torque converter and have it changed I have a 3000 stall but need around 4000. If you have too little holding capacity, you will start to blow through your converter and experience slippage. I finally stopped … Build your own custom newsletter with the content you love from Dragzine, directly to your inbox, absolutely FREE! You’re able to determine the stall speed range of your torque converter after it has been installed in your car. Stall speed is the speed at which the converter holds back or limits the engine speed if the transmission output is prohibited. HP Series Billet Stator Torque Converter Converter Diameter - 258mm This is a modified factory converter with billet stator. Any advice would be appreciated. That is one whole gear ratio less. In general, the desired stall speed should be 500-700 RPM below the engine RPM at peak torque. “The stator can have more or fewer fins changing the size of the windows that let fluid through to the turbine. Our initial All About Stall post established the significance of engine setup in choosing torque converter stall. Losing power during acceleration or going uphill is one of the most common clogged catalytic converter symptoms. Stall speed is the amount of rpm the engine can reach with the brakes locked and transmission in gear before the drive wheels turn. I have been debating doing the gear change. "Normally, the smaller the converter, the higher the stall is," Miller says, explaining how TCI can build a smaller converter with a lower stall number than most stock units. As the angle of those blades are manipulated, it will have a dramatic effect on how the converter behaves when power is applied by the engine. You can expect a total torque converter replacement cost of 300$ to 1500$. The stall converter enables a vehicle to use its torque curve for launching off the line stronger and better compared to a vehicle with a lower stall. Now, this is slightly slower than its best of 10.90, but this converter is built for the other changes we will be making to the car in the near future. The RPM (revolutions per minute) measured once the car’s engine maxes out is its stall speed. We look forward to equipping your vehicle with the right torque converter stall speed and boosting your performance to an all new level! If we had changed the 3.73 gear to a 4.56 gear ratio, the torque converter would in fact stall less due to the lower resistance needed to move the vehicle. You’ve got more than one option, so why not consider “How to Convert a Horse Stall into a Chicken Coop”? A new replacement torque converter costs between $100 and $400, depending on the vehicle model and converter type. It pushed me into the seat noticeably more, and I loved it. If you had a transbrake, you could find full stall by putting your foot to the floor and reading your tach. Morphing blades can do it! A torque converter’s job is to take the horsepower an engine produces and multiply that to make the car accelerate. A higher stall torque converter will let your car accelerate better because the car will be taking off at the rpm range where it is making the most power. It will even change with the weather, so there can be no exact stall speed,” Caine points out. Changing where the car has power being brought in and the amount will cause the converter to hit its stall point at a different place overall. The converter will contain thrust bearings in all … If your transmission is not shifting correctly, I'd suspect either the bands are … When shopping for a torque converter and determining which stall speed is best suited for you, we suggest you ask us. By Ralph KalalReplacement of transmission fluid ordinarily does not include draining the torque converter. 2- Determine the converter stall speed requirements based on the powerband of your camshaft. In essence flash stall and full stall are nearly identical. You need a higher stall converter after engine modifications. The converter and transmission might not be seeing nuclear levels of heat and the driveability might be better, but the performance at the track will suffer. GM 258mm Pro Series 8L90 Torque Converter. Typically, an 8-inch converter (depending on internal fin angle and the style of stator), will most likely flash stall at a … Not knowing the vehicle, year, or transmission that is in it, doesn't help. If Steve leaves while spraying his 250hp shot it might stall at 4500rpm. This was on drag radials, no tire spin though. Not only will this waste engine performance, but a higher stall speed will also cause the converter to slip more, which can create more heat, which will lead to more wear and tear … Stall speed and stall speed selection are terms that are frequently misused and misunderstood when shopping for a torque converter. Thanks, How to Identify a Faulty Torque Converter, Part II: Understanding Torque Converter Stall Speeds, Choosing the Right Torque Converter For Your Vehicle. When a torque converter is malfunctioning it can cause this stall speed to change and feel like the transmission is slipping. An RV power converter does exactly the opposite, changing alternating current to direct current. Switching to a higher stall-speed torque converter can provide the benefit of increased launch RPM and better low-speed acceleration. Torque converters can fail for many reasons, including dirty fluid, overheating and problems with stall speed, which is the RPM at which your torque converter shifts power from the engine to the automatic transmission. The torque converter “stall speed” is the speed that the engine needs to be turning before the torque converter will begin engaging the transmission. … If you don’t know these exact specifications, we recommend giving a conservative estimate. Determining the stall speed needs for an all-out racecar or a street/strip car that is looking for the best elapsed time will usually start on the looser end of the converter spectrum. To an extent, the overall diameter and the internal construction of a converter can cause a substantial change in footbrake stall. If you’re planning on bringing a power-adder into the mix with your car, that will absolutely require a change in your torque converter’s stall speed. “Kamikaze” Plots Return From Devastating “Street Outlaws” Crash. Stall speed is a relative term. For argument sake, let's say we're testing a 3500 stall Yank ST 3500. The converter could still be junk. It felt like I had swapped to a 350, when launching. Let’s explain this a bit better. Lets say I have a converter that stalls at 2000rpm behind a 4.3 V6. Valve lift is a stout .612/.585-inch, and the LSA is 113/110 degrees. The maximum RPM displayed is the stall speed of the vehicle’s converter. When Brian is not writing, you can find him at the track as a crew chief, doing freelance photography, or beating on his nitrous-fed 2000 Trans Am. The slipping occurs while you're driving or changing gears, and it usually comes with some odd noises too. There are many factors that go into choosing the correct stall speed for your car, and each must be examined in order for the torque converter to do its job properly. As mentioned earlier, besides the engine’s ability to produce power, the weight, gear ratio, and tire height all play a role in what the converter’s stall speed needs to be. Stators come different shapes, sizes, and materials, but they all have the same job of making sure the converter is reaching the correct stall speed. If the stall speed measured is lower than what is specified for your torque converter, then it may be the beginning of its end. As a general rule for street use, obtain a stall speed with a minimum of 500 rpm into the powerband. Even seasoned car enthusiasts are guilty. The great part about this converter is that ATI includes the pilot necessary to get the torque converter to fit on the input shaft with no additional shims. “Heat is the biggest issue. The first thing that you will need to know is approximately where the engine starts to make its power. The range listed will tell you what to expect from the converter. In contrast to the … This ensures a margin for application for the torque converter to take off. If I need to do the trans, I have to take it elsewhere. I think my engine tuner told me he doesn't do trannys, just engines. If you go into a higher stall speed range, the car has the ability to produce better elapsed times, however, it will start to generate a lot more heat on the street and lose some drivability. If you are unsure about these modifications, the experts at RevMax Performance Torque Converters can help. This is the first segment in our series on stall speeds. As we add power and sort out some other items, the car will respond better down low while still being efficient at the top end. “The overall size of the torque converter has to do with its efficiency and holding power. Nelson Gill, President and CEO of ACC Performance, then demonstrated how variables in engine setup — things like cylinder heads and exhaust choice — can change your ideal stall speed in Part 2 of the series. An N/A torque converter will typically want to be lightweight, whereas a power-adder converter will most likely want a heavy cover and anti-ballooning plates, and each will have a different stall speed range, too.”, Stalling The Dragon: What Went Into Choosing The Converter. But you don't want a stall speed that is too high either. Or does this chain react changing or doing other things. Do I need to tune the trans computer? Just wondering if you had an idea of what would be a good speed stall for me. Actually, you can covert any covered enclosure that can be closed up at night, whether it be an old outbuilding or the back of a garage…maybe even an unused garden shed! It just didn’t fit the combination of the car. “Doing the test on the return road after a pass is good because everything is at temperature, and you have the weight of the car working in the equation, as well. I'm building a 408 stroker with a cam and planning on a 3000-3200rpm converter. Just selecting a random converter based on a few calculations from a website will not allow your car to perform its best, and could actually hurt your ability to get the best ET’s possible when at the track; it’s important to ensure you have the right configuration for your application. Changing where the car has power being brought in and the amount will cause the converter to hit its stall point at a different place overall. One way to check a converter’s stall speed is to place the vehicle in Drive and press on the brake firmly – the throttle can be depressed fully for some seconds. So, we're going to give everyone a road map to finding that right point. All rights reserved. For a car that is setup for street/strip use, you will need to be a little more conservative, but you still need to ensure it gets past what we call ‘the stumble zone.’ The object is to get the engine into an area of the power-band where it’s happy and can accelerate easily without stumbling.”. But, what if you want to Think of it as a balancing act. In many cases, a good aftermarket converter will give you 1,000 extra rpm to put the power to the ground with more authority. But I was in for another surprise. There can be some confusion that the stall speed of a torque converter is an absolute thing. To break this down, we’ve taken a look at the basics of stall speed with Dave Caine from. See … Checking for a stall speed on the footbrake isn’t the most accurate way because you’re only at part throttle and not making a large amount of torque, so the converter will not see much stall speed. A General Motors TH350 with a 2.52:1 first gear or a TH400 with a 2.48:1 first gear will use a higher stall speed converter than would a TH700R-4 with a first gear rated at 3.06:1. Caine further explains what can happen with too big of a stall speed on the street for a torque converter. There are many factors that go into choosing the correct stall speed for your car, and each must be examined in order for the torque converter to do its job properly. The torque converter had entirely too high of a stall speed, and it wasn’t allowing the Red Dragon to reach its full potential with our goals, so it was time for a change. The slipping occurs while you're driving or changing gears, and it usually comes with some odd noises too. According to Caine, the stall speed will be different for each, but how you determine it remains the same. It's the sweet spot tuners know will get that car down the track with consistent HP, and the best ET’s. In general, the larger the converter, typically the tighter and more efficient it will be. Our torque converter experts are standing by to help you select best suited stall speed, torque converter combination for your vehicle. Put simply, it’s the converter. For example, In most cases, one of TCI’s 10-inch competition-model converters will footbrake much higher than one of their 8-inch converters. If your differential gearing were numerically low, you would want to go with a higher stall speed. because if you buy a converter first, and then switch to a different cam later, then that can change the stall speed rpm and change you converter requirements unless perhaps it's a very similar camshaft than the one you have. Rigid blades are unfit to reproduce this kind of motion. A New Propeller Blade Concept for Improved Efficiency Proven & Supported Mathematically Ready for Implementation Applicable to – traditional propeller propulsion systems , – turboprops , – turbofans . The old converter in the Red Dragon was flashing at nearly 4,000 rpm on motor and a whopping 5,200 rpm on nitrous. We will safeguard your e-mail and only send content you request. The labor cost to replace the torque converter is between $200 and $1000, depending on the vehicle model, and the workshop will make the work. – Dave Caine, “Going to wide open throttle on a transbrake, you will make more torque, so the converter will flash much higher. It only reacts to a situation; it does not dictate anything. The stall speed assigned is simply a way to rate the converter’s performance level. In order for our customer’s to make informed decisions, we feel that is important for them to know what they are shopping for. Aug 21, 2017 - Explore Brenda Garlisi's board "Tub to Shower Conversion" on Pinterest. Mail the part back to RevMax following the directions on your packing slip. We'll send you the most interesting Dragzine articles, news, car features, and videos every week. 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Torque converters come in a range of sizes, and that size will impact how the converter will behave with an engine. What they do is essentially re machine it and shave some of the weight, along with changing a few things effecting the stall speed. A lot goes into the process of not only building a torque converter, but also making sure the torque converter will work with your car when it comes to stall speed. These types of tests can lead to premature failure of the converter and are not a recommended practice.”, How To Select The Correct Stall Speed For Your Car. Variable Stall Control uses a different approach to make the converter more versatile and efficient. Tried to search, but didn't know what key word to use. If you're going to run a steep stall 3000+ make sure you run an adequate transmission cooler and steep gears. High performance torque converters, like to ones sold at RevMax Performance Torque Converters, can do a lot for your vehicle when the proper stall speed is selected.